Sunday, May 24, 2009

Debate Help

*Disclaimer: I am not saying that these two things are in any way the same.

On almost every point of debate and reason I can defend myself and the position that I believe I should follow (even though I am not following it yet) except one. Pedophilia. Again, not saying that Gay=pedophile at all. But the same reasons we advocate for equal religious treatment can be and is used by pedophiles to justify their actions.

They don't know why they are attracted to kids, they didn't choose this.
The church tells them it is wrong and to remain celibate (or marry if so inclined)

There are more similarities in arguments that my tired brain isn't thinking of right now. But How can we call for equality while they get left behind (rightly so) even though their arguments are the same as ours? THe only thing I can see is if the pedophilia is not always a complete singular attraction to children (ie there is not "6" on a kinsey scale)
Also I do not know where it comes from, but does it matter? If it is not a choice (the actions are yes) then what right do we have to advocate for equality? Are we just a satanic perversion of truth?


  1. Pedophiles act out on their desires with unwilling participants - in other words, they rape their victims.

    Now, some of their victims may willingly participate in the act - but it can be argued that, as children, they are not mature enough to make such a decision - so it still constitutes rape.

  2. I agree with Abelard exactly. I wrote out a much longer explanation of why I believe that, but it got erased when I tried to post and I'm too lazy to type it again :)

  3. I was going to say, there's no comparison here... we are charged with the sacred duty of protecting our children. Having any sort of sexual intimacy with them is 100% wrong because it violates a sacred trust and responsibility, and takes advantage of established social power positions... I don't understand how this could even be an issue in anyone's mind.

  4. From the way I see things, gays have a claim to equality because gay couples have been performing equally (both in the positive and negative aspects) to straight couples.

    So, if a pedophile is to be justified in the same way gays are seeking justification, then pedophiles need to show that their relationships are able to perform equally to the healthiest of other socially recognized relationships (which, in my opinion, are maturely consensual, monogamous throughout life, a healthy alternative to any other lifestyle, and able to successfully raise children).

    In my mind, it would, therefore, need to be proven that 1) a child, as Abe mentioned, is mature enough to make such a decision of coupling; 2) a pedophile will stay monogamously with his/her lover "until death do [they] part" and not "until adulthood of the younger party do they part"; 3) a relationship with an older person is a healthy alternative to living the more common life of a child/teenager; and 4) such a couple holds the resources (of emotion and maturity included) to successfully raise children if so desired.

    I believe such things have been solidly proven for homosexual couples as much as they have been solidly proven for heterosexual couples. I do not believe such things have been solidly proven for couples of pedophilia.

  5. Plus, I think it is defensible that pedophilia does indeed cause palpable damage to the children involved (both physically but more importantly emotional scarring).


  6. @Tommy: I'm sure such is true when the child was not involved in the decision to enter into the relationship. I don't know if it is proven when the child consensually enters into the relationship (on that same note, though, I also don't know if a child every truly enters into a relationship without having to be persuaded... of course, there's that one teacher-student relationship that ended in marriage after the teacher got out of prison).